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Price of Land?

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andy

I have recently been in negotiations for the price of a small plot of land along side the Mekong river.

I am very happy with the agreed price and the location. For some people the location may be a little remote! The nearest market is a 45 minute boat ride to Laos. The closest big city, is around 2 hours drive. Although there are a few small hamlets on the way.

The land appeals to me! It is ideally situated with a cool breeze along the river.

 

I have 2 friends here who have recently bought land of about the same size of what I am proposing to buy, but in different areas.  

One Cambodian who has paid $30,000 and has his building well on its way in Koh Kong province. The other a westerner, whom has bought in is girlfriends name in Kampong Chhnang, for the price of $20,000.

 

It would be interesting to know if any forum members know of land prices in areas around the country. And also there stories! good or bad.

 

Photo's of the land -

 

post-1230-0-09912300-1463070798_thumb.jpg

 

I have had a quote to clear the land by tractor of $70, there are 3 good fruit trees in there I wish to keep.

 

post-1230-0-64894400-1463070760_thumb.jpg

 

It would be nice to construct a nice deck here! for relaxing and bathing.

 

post-1230-0-91387600-1463070722_thumb.jpg

 

The Mekong view of Laos in the distance. 

 

 

I have also been asked by other members if the Land is Hard Title! With research I would say 90% of land owned will possibly be Soft Title. I am prepared to be corrected. Knowledge and understanding is important.

 

The following my be of interest - 

 

The hard and the soft of land title ownership in Cambodia

 

The titling of land and the establishment of ownership rights is one
of the most critical issues confronting development in Cambodia today.

While the majority of well-publicised disputes tend to pit the poor
against the powerful, certainty of title is a prerequisite for anyone
who hopes to own land and build in the Kingdom.

Can you give a brief history of land title in Cambodia?
In 1989, a regulation was passed allowing private ownership of
residential properties and possession status on agricultural property
up to five hectares. Prior to that it was all state land.

In 1994, a land law [the Law on the Country Planning, Urbanization and
Construction] was passed that basically formalised this and made a
distinction between residential properties and nonresidential
properties for ownership purposes.
In 2001 the Land Law came along and basically allowed private
ownership of most types of land.

How is land registered in Cambodia?
All land will eventually be registered at the Ministry of Land
Management cadastral office. At the moment everybody is on what they
call soft title, in which land is registered at the local level only
and not at the national level. It is technically possession status,
not ownership.

Hard title is land that is registered at the national registry and has
a title deed. The World Bank is currently sponsoring a program where
it is bit-by-bit going around demarcating everything and identifying
who owns what.

When you buy a piece of land, how do you ensure you have the only
title?
The first thing you do is get whatever documentation the person
selling the land has, and that will tell you if it is hard title or
soft title. If it's national title, you go to the national register
and confirm it, but you still reconfirm at the district level that
there have been no transactions since the issuance of the national
title.

If it is soft title, you would do due-diligence at the local sangkat
[commune] office and the district office to identify who they see as
the owners or possessors of that piece of land. You would also do due
diligence with the neighbours and ask them who they see as the owners
of that land.

If each of those people says the same thing, you are pretty safe. If
any of those people say something different to the others, then you
have to investigate further. Your biggest problem ordinarily is
overlapping boundaries; there was no science to demarcating borders in
the old days and the creep of overlaps can be quite substantial.

What counts as proof of soft title?
Title documentation can take a variety of forms, including building
applications, which act as proof of ownership. Bear in mind that most
people have no paperwork - they were just there and never actually
formalized anything.

People with no ownership documents will go down to the local sangkat
and get a possession status certificate, and that is fine. The other
thing you might see is a letter of transfer from the previous
possessor stamped by the local sangkat and the district office, and
that is proof of soft title at the local level.

It all comes down to the district and local offices recognizing
somebody, and they will create the paperwork if need be to confirm
that. It is with that bit of paper you go forward.

In the event there is a land dispute, what are the resolution
channels?
It depends on the level of registration. If you have soft title it
will go to the cadastral committee for dispute resolution. They will
go into the area and ask people to tell them who owns what. They will
put that up publicly, and, if there are no contestations, that will be
put on the national register and that becomes forever-and-a-day
ownership with those borders for those people named. If anybody comes
forward and contests those demarcations, everybody will need to bring
their evidence forward to the cadastral committee and they will assess
the evidence and make a call.

There is also a national land dispute committee under the Council of
Ministers that was set up a couple of years ago to oversee land
disputes that is separate to the cadastral committee. They usually try
to get parties to agree to a resolution, but they can make a call.

The third entity is the courts. You should never be denied the right
to go to court on any dispute because it's the courts that have that
mandate under the constitution. They should be the final arbiter
always.

What do the dispute committees and the courts base their decisions on?
Ownership is based on the principle of certainty of title. This is
conferred on people not by contract or by deed with the previous owner
but by the registrar. Ownership of land, and transfer of ownership, is
decided at the time the Registrar General changes the books.

If Mr A sells land to Mr B, Mr B becomes the owner as a matter-of-fact
under law when the Registrar General changes the books. If someone is
wrongly put on there, the previous owner has an issue against the
Registrar General, not against the owner of the title, who is now in
matter-of-fact the owner.

What is on the register is absolute proof of ownership; so, if there
is a contest in court, you should be able to take the title deeds to
court, say it's got my name on it - end of story. There is nothing for
the court to determine, unless there has been fraud. The system is
such that the courts shouldn't be involved.

 

       

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dicey eye

Soft title sounds like it could evolve into a hornets nest of ambiguous issues. Kinda scary.

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phuketrichard

I have 2 friends here who have recently bought land of about the same size of what I am proposing to buy, but in different areas.  

One Cambodian who has paid $30,000 and has his building well on its way in Koh Kong province. The other a westerner, whom has bought in is girlfriends name in Kampong Chhnang, for the price of $20,000.

 

 

Doesn't mean anything with out the size.

 

we ( gf and I ) own (her name)

a 3,000 sq meter piece of land in Svay Rieng province. grows rice,

cost me $5,500 3 years ago.

We also have a piece in Kep ( 25 meters x 6 meters ) that was $12,000, right on the main road between Kep and Kampot  about 4 kms from the crab market.

 

The land in the photo is scrub land in the middle of nowhere an should be very very low price.

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andy

Soft title sounds like it could evolve into a hornets nest of ambiguous issues. Kinda scary.

 

So dicey if it turns out to be a Soft title (probable so! Like most Cambodian land). It would only be hassle, and not worth the time and money? I do value peoples opinions. With this post I hope to learn more. 

 

 

Doesn't mean anything with out the size.

 

we ( gf and I ) own (her name)

a 3,000 sq meter piece of land in Svay Rieng province. grows rice,

 

The land in the photo is scrub land in the middle of nowhere an should be very very low price.

 

Richard the scrub land is the same size has my other two friends! 2,500 sq meter. at a selling price and papers in the girlfriends name of $2,250 that works out at less then $1 per sq meter.

Electricity runs next to the land, so I see no problems getting power. The land backs on to the river front, so no problem to pump water.

The houses in the area are has pictured here-

post-1230-0-79420900-1463147684_thumb.jpg

post-1230-0-47188600-1463147704_thumb.jpg

 

I have already talked with some building contractors to build a house like the photo's. The quotes I have so far are $7000 to $8000

 

post-1230-0-87395600-1463148322_thumb.jpg

People clearing other land, ready to build.

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andy

I would also like to add these photo's. This is about less than one hours moto ride from the property.

Idyllic place just down river.

 

post-1230-0-05479200-1463148960_thumb.jpg

 

post-1230-0-05352000-1463148978_thumb.jpg 

 

  

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mollydooker

Looks good Andy .....just proceed with caution ....

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Parrothead

Looks good Andy .....just proceed with caution ....

 

Andy and I have spoken several times regarding that area. He has shown the location to me on a map. His intentions, I believe, are to start a business there. I just hope he has the population base to support his business. Otherwise, I wouldn't give that area a second thought. 

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phuketrichard

for that price in that area its an ok price, not great or cheap as ur still in the middle of nowhere and the land seems not plantable as looks like sand/brush land.so you cant make $$ of it.

What kind of business?  local orientated?  i doubt many living up there have more than minimum money

 

you say u have electric nearby, at what price/kwh>

how deep to you need to go for water?  Taking water from the river??

Make sure u have legal road access, if to get to your house, u need pass anyone else's land

 

Are you prepared to live nowhere with illiterate khmers and live like a poor local?   I wouldn't be able to,I would go stir crazy, hence why i live here and ONLY if i cant stay, would we move

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andy

Will get back to you all soon! Just on my way back to visit the area. Will answer your questions when I return.

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andy

Now back! To answer some of your questions? I did not buy the first proposed land! I re-negotiated at a lower price, it was not accepted. The reason for this I was to buy a plot 28mtr x 100mtr planted with mature fruit trees (mango and banana). Sorry no photo's of this.

 

Next! The other land I have acquired just 2mins away from the planted plot. 36mtr x 150mtr. So 5400sqmtr. From the main road to the river bank. This is where I intend to land-fill and build the house. 

The business will be aquaponics based. Plus soil based plantation too, since I can run irrigation pipes from the river. The pH levels are good. The water is clean. I think because the Mekong is so vast.

 

post-1230-0-49007300-1464000611_thumb.jpg

The house I will have built, will replace the existing house in the middle of the photo. There are a few coconut and fruit trees on the land.

 

I have enquired about the fencing, and top soil. (price, delivery. and I have the labour too). Electricity is at 980khw. The plot has a shower and toilet, (working and closed to prevent local use, You can see the white building in the photo). I will build another with the house.

 

post-1230-0-59079700-1464001672_thumb.jpg

I have been looking for good builders in the area! I came across these building this house. Now have to work out the price and time scale.

 

post-1230-0-27224000-1464002138_thumb.jpg 

Just a small moto ride down the road. 

  

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